Knock sensor or dealer copout? - Page 8

PapaBear · 07-14-2011, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisheltra

Chalk it up to his guilty conscience bro.

I can do that but I'm still left with a performance vehicle that won't perform.

LXtasy · 07-14-2011, 07:40 PM

you will get no where giving them a bill.

PapaBear · 07-14-2011, 07:47 PM

Yeah I know, but it would make me feel better even if they didn't pay it.

csikx · 07-14-2011, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PapaBear

Does anybody else on here see where this thread was "not nice" towards them? I mean really? Sure you can sense my frustration in every post, but can you construe any of it as an attack on their business?

Why do you even care? You seem pretty concerned. They didn't help you at all. Who fucking cares if they can read this thread? They should, because I wouldn't want to take my ride to a bunch of OMG 3lite cerfyed ASE wotech geniuses that couldn't diagnose this problem and just hand it back to the customer and tell them essentially to take care of it. Another reason, Rick Hendrick will never get a fucking dime of my money.

PapaBear · 07-14-2011, 07:57 PM

I'm concerned because I care. I thought always that chris would look out for me. He did.....kinda. But to blow me off because of something that he reads on the Internet? I didn't come on here bashing Rick Hendrick. I came on here expressing my frustrations to u guys and hoping to learn some other things to tell them to help them diagnose the problem. Sure you could read anything into it you want to but seriously?

Yeah, should have learned when they had my wifes car for more than a month and all they did was throw parts at it until they fixed it. Or did they? Four months later, same issue arises again.

Whatever. I still need help though. Anyone wanna supervise me while I dismantle top half of my motor to diagnose this thing? I'm a bolt on guy, not an engine builder. A broke one at that.....

csikx · 07-14-2011, 08:00 PM

If the dude was so concerned, he could have came on here and gotten some ideas or at least posted. You did nothing wrong and weren't outta line. Let them throw a temper tantrum.

AverageJoe · 07-14-2011, 08:01 PM

The mechanics at local gm dealers are "bolt-on" guys too. If the code reader cant find the problem, they cant fix it.

csikx · 07-14-2011, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AverageJoe

The mechanics at local gm dealers are "bolt-on" guys too. If the code reader cant find the problem, they cant fix it.

PapaBear · 07-14-2011, 08:07 PM

Well apparently this guy has the most experience of all of the shop on "modified" vehicles.

How do you tell if a lifter is bad other than noise?

ForceFed4g63 · 07-14-2011, 08:15 PM

If it's loose or looks out of place in any way from the other ones.

98Camarod · 07-14-2011, 08:28 PM

I definitely wouldn't dive in thinking it's a lifter. I think what you should do is talk to a local guy with hp tuners or efi live that tunes and see if they can fix your issue. That's where I and other's believe it's at. Maybe you can work something out so that if they fix it you pay, if not then thanks for your time here's some beer or something.

If you absolutely feel you have to go into the motor, I wouldn't go directly to the lifter. That involves taking the head off. Instead, take the valve cover off 8mm bolts, rocker arm 8mm bolt and check the push rod. Lay it on a flat surface and roll it. If it wobbles, then there's your problem.

Torque value for the rocker arm is 22 ft-lbs.

ForceFed4g63 · 07-14-2011, 08:32 PM

You have to take the whole head off to check the lifters???

98Camarod · 07-14-2011, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForceFed4g63

You have to take the whole head off to check the lifters???

yup

ForceFed4g63 · 07-14-2011, 08:40 PM

Wow...makes me rethink wanting a V8, I'm used to popping off the valve cover and having access to everything...

98Camarod · 07-14-2011, 08:47 PM

This is for a lsx series motor. I don't know of anyone that has had a lifter go out on them with stock longblock. It's not something that should make you stay away by any means.

minytrker · 07-14-2011, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AverageJoe

The mechanics at local gm dealers are "bolt-on" guys too. If the code reader cant find the problem, they cant fix it.

Yep...thats about the end of there trouble shooting skills.

schardbody · 07-14-2011, 08:51 PM

they want no part of the truck anymore because they are worried about public humiliation when they cant figure out the problem......

like someone else said if the computer doesnt spit out a specific problem that localized to a very common problem then they are stumped.

the VERY second thing done should have been a compression and leakdown test, while its likely it'll come back in spec it would atleast rule out a few things.

they wouldnt be able to diagnose a valvespring issue unless its obviously broken, my opinion is its likely just weak.

a bent pushrod would cause less power from that cylinder which would show up as a misfire (cylinder contribution) but i've never seen an LS bend a pushrod even when being over revved.

a lifter is another possible cause but you really wont know much without pulling the head and swapping them since its a higher RPM issue they/it is probably going to appear fine to the eye just like the valve spring....

be glad they decided to send you packing, they never would have figured it out and you'd have a truck that was part swapped until they were fed up, because throwing parts at a problem is all they are capable of, even with all the technical support and equipment they are still incompetent....

Matts94Z28 · 07-14-2011, 09:14 PM

Maybe schardbody can fix it!

Matts94Z28 · 07-14-2011, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PapaBear

Well apparently this guy has the most experience of all of the shop on "modified" vehicles.

How do you tell if a lifter is bad other than noise?

The Pushrod can be check in less than an hour if you know what you are doing. If you need help pulling them, let me know. I can give you a hand if you need it. I also have some extra push rods from a 6.0 I had. If it is in fact the issue, I can give you a new set.

I also have some stock lifters.

gearmesh, inc. · 07-14-2011, 09:56 PM

Dealerships only have a service department because the manufacturer makes them service what they sell as part of the franchise agreement. If the owners and upper management could have their way, they would only sell cars and that would be the end of it.

Since the service department is the bastard child sideshow of the dealership, they definitely aren't too interested in staffing the place with the brightest techs, which means the cheapest they can find. At best, only about 1 in 10 of the techs in the place that can work a vehicle from bumper to bumper. Sooner or later, the one or two smart techs will get out of the dealership game to start their own shop or find another trade.

The UAW has managed to secure the biggest chunk of money out of the price of a new car. That leaves very little cash out of the price to cover any warranty claims. Its way easier for the manufacturer to short change the franchise end of the car business via below market labor reimbursement for any warranty work done by the service department.

Warranty flat rate labor time sucks for any of the big 3. A tech can change a long block under warranty and only get paid for 8-10 hours of labor. Any decent tech that does it right will have about 13 to 15 actual hours in the job. Experienced techs won't hang around long in that environment.

Its way easier for a service department to just abandon a hard to find problem when they can point the finger at aftermarket mods. The tech only gets paid for claiming to replace a faulty part. They are lucky if they even get paid to diagnose a problem.

Be glad you got away from the dealer without them voiding your warranty nationwide. You got away from that mess about the best you could (free).

07-14-2011, 07:40 PM	#142
LXtasy Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Summerville, SC Posts: 9,564	you will get no where giving them a bill. __________________

07-14-2011, 09:14 PM	#158
Matts94Z28 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Summerville Posts: 12,039	Maybe schardbody can fix it! __________________ Charleston Performance Solutions 4560 Rivers Ave. N. Charleston SC 29405 843-225-1142 https://www.facebook.com/CharlestonPerformanceSolutions www.facebook.com/Selepack

07-14-2011, 09:56 PM	#160
gearmesh, inc. creepy azz cracka Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Summerville Posts: 1,587	Dealerships only have a service department because the manufacturer makes them service what they sell as part of the franchise agreement. If the owners and upper management could have their way, they would only sell cars and that would be the end of it. Since the service department is the bastard child sideshow of the dealership, they definitely aren't too interested in staffing the place with the brightest techs, which means the cheapest they can find. At best, only about 1 in 10 of the techs in the place that can work a vehicle from bumper to bumper. Sooner or later, the one or two smart techs will get out of the dealership game to start their own shop or find another trade. The UAW has managed to secure the biggest chunk of money out of the price of a new car. That leaves very little cash out of the price to cover any warranty claims. Its way easier for the manufacturer to short change the franchise end of the car business via below market labor reimbursement for any warranty work done by the service department. Warranty flat rate labor time sucks for any of the big 3. A tech can change a long block under warranty and only get paid for 8-10 hours of labor. Any decent tech that does it right will have about 13 to 15 actual hours in the job. Experienced techs won't hang around long in that environment. Its way easier for a service department to just abandon a hard to find problem when they can point the finger at aftermarket mods. The tech only gets paid for claiming to replace a faulty part. They are lucky if they even get paid to diagnose a problem. Be glad you got away from the dealer without them voiding your warranty nationwide. You got away from that mess about the best you could (free). __________________ "I came into this world kicking, screaming,and covered in someone else's blood, I have no problem leaving the same way!" ÔÇ£If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. ThatÔÇÖs ridiculous. If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid about?ÔÇØ -Clint Smith, Thunder Ranch.

07-14-2011, 07:47 PM	#143
PapaBear Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,809	Yeah I know, but it would make me feel better even if they didn't pay it.

07-14-2011, 07:57 PM	#145
PapaBear Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,809	I'm concerned because I care. I thought always that chris would look out for me. He did.....kinda. But to blow me off because of something that he reads on the Internet? I didn't come on here bashing Rick Hendrick. I came on here expressing my frustrations to u guys and hoping to learn some other things to tell them to help them diagnose the problem. Sure you could read anything into it you want to but seriously? Yeah, should have learned when they had my wifes car for more than a month and all they did was throw parts at it until they fixed it. Or did they? Four months later, same issue arises again. Whatever. I still need help though. Anyone wanna supervise me while I dismantle top half of my motor to diagnose this thing? I'm a bolt on guy, not an engine builder. A broke one at that.....

07-14-2011, 08:00 PM	#146
csikx Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 1,398	If the dude was so concerned, he could have came on here and gotten some ideas or at least posted. You did nothing wrong and weren't outta line. Let them throw a temper tantrum.

07-14-2011, 08:07 PM	#149
PapaBear Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,809	Well apparently this guy has the most experience of all of the shop on "modified" vehicles. How do you tell if a lifter is bad other than noise?

07-14-2011, 08:15 PM	#150
ForceFed4g63 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Aiken Posts: 7,002	If it's loose or looks out of place in any way from the other ones.

07-14-2011, 08:28 PM	#151
98Camarod Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Summerville, SC Posts: 1,525	I definitely wouldn't dive in thinking it's a lifter. I think what you should do is talk to a local guy with hp tuners or efi live that tunes and see if they can fix your issue. That's where I and other's believe it's at. Maybe you can work something out so that if they fix it you pay, if not then thanks for your time here's some beer or something. If you absolutely feel you have to go into the motor, I wouldn't go directly to the lifter. That involves taking the head off. Instead, take the valve cover off 8mm bolts, rocker arm 8mm bolt and check the push rod. Lay it on a flat surface and roll it. If it wobbles, then there's your problem. Torque value for the rocker arm is 22 ft-lbs.

07-14-2011, 08:32 PM	#152
ForceFed4g63 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Aiken Posts: 7,002	You have to take the whole head off to check the lifters???

07-14-2011, 08:40 PM	#154
ForceFed4g63 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Aiken Posts: 7,002	Wow...makes me rethink wanting a V8, I'm used to popping off the valve cover and having access to everything...

07-14-2011, 08:47 PM	#155
98Camarod Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Summerville, SC Posts: 1,525	This is for a lsx series motor. I don't know of anyone that has had a lifter go out on them with stock longblock. It's not something that should make you stay away by any means.

07-14-2011, 08:51 PM	#157
schardbody Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 1,158	they want no part of the truck anymore because they are worried about public humiliation when they cant figure out the problem...... like someone else said if the computer doesnt spit out a specific problem that localized to a very common problem then they are stumped. the VERY second thing done should have been a compression and leakdown test, while its likely it'll come back in spec it would atleast rule out a few things. they wouldnt be able to diagnose a valvespring issue unless its obviously broken, my opinion is its likely just weak. a bent pushrod would cause less power from that cylinder which would show up as a misfire (cylinder contribution) but i've never seen an LS bend a pushrod even when being over revved. a lifter is another possible cause but you really wont know much without pulling the head and swapping them since its a higher RPM issue they/it is probably going to appear fine to the eye just like the valve spring.... be glad they decided to send you packing, they never would have figured it out and you'd have a truck that was part swapped until they were fed up, because throwing parts at a problem is all they are capable of, even with all the technical support and equipment they are still incompetent....